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AP vs AD Jax?


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#1
OFFLINE   Raro

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Hi...

So I just played this game where we kinda got owned...
I was on Jax trying AP for the first time and ended with 6/7/2
Then there was
Eve: 3/5/2
Ez: 2/6/3
Mundo: 3/8/4
Trynd: 1/7/3

First off I do believe that AD Jax is better than AP Jax but realised that I couldn't really go around saying that never having played AP before...
Then I got into an argument with Ez, Mundo and Warick + Malphite from the other team about how AD was better and I was left to defend AP... (I actually kinda started it... Well Mundo commented and then they started commenting on it in game but I wanted to know what they thought so brought it back up afterwards ;))
Anyway, I failed miserably :)

What are your opinions on this matter?
What makes AP Jax so bad / good compared to AD?

Mundo's Points... Well he didn't have any and just left.
Malphite's Points: "He Sucks"
Warick's Points: No Ult Power + no Survivability (His Passive should give him this shouldn't it, expecially seeing as you can get more AP for cheaper than AD using items)
Ez's points: Slower CD than all other mage characters, useless ult, lowed base AP than Nid, Stun put to no use because can't auto attack anymore, compare Guinsoos to infinity, Nid = Better AP than Jax, Use a mage

Are they right or is AP Jax actually viable?

Edit:
The argument started while we were in the Jungle... All 5 of us were there (can't remember why... probably chasing down someone) and then all their team members came out of nowhere...
We all tried to run but I realised that we didn't really have a chance so I stayed back to try and hold them off for a couple of seconds so that my Team mates would be able to run or at least have more of a chance...
I managed to hold them off for like 5 seconds thanks to my stun + being on full hp in the first place but when I stayed to fight 3 of them just stopped and watched while Trynd kept running (which would've been the smart thing to do) and after I died, Eve went in to try get a kill on one of the low hp guys, she failed and died, then Mundo and after he died Ez tried and I was just like ?@#!@#! and then they blamed it on me for going AP or something which I find completely irralevent.
Then Trynd died when he was almost at base somehow... =/

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#2
OFFLINE   Lunaras

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it is kinda, but generally AD is better purely for the life steal

lichbane 400 ap leap strike empower alone will knock alot of people to half health, the problem is what happens next?


kinda the same argument with ad/ap kat, "ads better" "ads better" "ads better", boom a ap kat shows up and half ur health is gone from one shunpo

#3
OFFLINE   Raro

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So would AP be more of a burst type of guy?

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#4
OFFLINE   Heat n Serve

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Both are viable, they each have their tradeoffs. I wouldn't take much of what they said too seriously.

Most people that think his ult sucks are the same people that don't build magic penetration.

Ez's points are mildly valid, but that's just why you build Nashor's Tooth on AP Jax... this will be even more potent after the attack speed buff to Nashor's Tooth.

Nashor's and 2x rageblades are key. The rest is situational after that, but I generally prefer Tri-force and Madred's Bloodrazor to round out the build.

Of course, you need to stack magic penetration Marks and Quints, and be mindful of your enemies' magic resist values. Whether to get Sorc shoes or Berserker greaves is up to you.
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#5
OFFLINE   ChainsawMonkey

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Ap jax is awesome every 3 hits do upwards of 400 dmg easily and his AP stacks up so well, you dont even need survivability items
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#6
OFFLINE   xnopityx

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I play hybrid so I am spared these arguments but if I had to choose Id go AP. With all your items you can take most people to half or below easily with your first leap. And with all the hp you get from you items they just wont be able to kill you before you kill them.

#7
OFFLINE   Pete

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If you get 2 Rageblades do you get twice the effect from one charge or do you only get charges from one Rageblade?

#8
OFFLINE   Heat n Serve

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Still only a max of 8 charges. However, it will charge twice as fast.
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#9
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Quote

If you get 2 Rageblades do you get twice the effect from one charge or do you only get charges from one Rageblade?


You can only get one stack of the Rageblade effect PER Rageblade.

1x Rageblade: 1xAttack and you get 1x rageblade stack.
2x Rageblade: 1xAttack and you get 2x rageblade stack.

But you won't ever be able to surpass the 8x stacks even if you have more rageblades.

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#10
OFFLINE   RacerRalf

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a shame that you don't get more stacks on rageblade..

and to add to the thread..

ap Jax is a force to be taken seriously.. it got some nasty burst, and all his skills scale with ap, and many won't think that you ap, and stack armor against you, woo!

I'm currently trying to make a viable ap Jax build to see what works and what don't.. will post when I find something that's good ^^
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#11
OFFLINE   Zero-Control

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Let me help you all out. In a recent interview with a Riot dev, it was stated that there are only 2 actual hybrids in the game, Jax being one of them.

With that said... go BOTH, dont do just 1.

You can make him work with just 1 but with his passive, fast attack speed, and his great ap scale why not?

A sample build is like this:

Tabi boots(or merc treads against casters... you will need to have a good dodge rune set to do this but with diminishing returns and a phantom it wont hurt you much)
Rageblade (this is jax's item, hands down, get it, every stat is vital)
Soul Stealer (easy ap if you dont die too much, I get this second or third depending on the game and once its up to around 11 I think all of your ap abilities are hitting over 200)
Sword of the Occult( see above.... remember that hybrid thing we talked about, well...... lookey its like another rage blade move)

I will pause here and mention, two snowball items is dangerous, dont do it if its not going to charge for you, defintly dont want to get stuck with a useless snowball item.... I have gotten both in my last 4 games as Jax and each game I had minimum of 11 charges on them by playing smart.

Phantom (another item built for jax and the only other dodge item in the game after tabi)

Thirster (since I dont specifically go AD, I dont worry about crit, and rather I care more about stacking HP, this is a good hp item, in an AD build you would want an infinity)

As an alternative to the Sword of the occult you could get a phage -> Frozen mallet, you may want to anyway, may be a smarter way to go. CC for Jax is pretty important.

Other options that are equally viable, are Ryalis.... archangels if you want to have infinite mana and high AP ...I think with the mana loaded you are looking at around 90 apish... which makes it the third highest ap behind SS and rageblade (and I guess zhonya's.....).

The bottom line is there really is no item that wont make you kill quicker.

And remember if you raise ap that means your ult does more damage, getting AS is another way to increase that damage, that means say.... Rageblade, Divinity, Phantom and SS would make you attack fast and hit harder... (and counter enemy jax)

Just some thoughts.

#12
OFFLINE   Uggii

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Its maybe kinda off-topic, but maybe affects AD or AP jax:

How instense would you go for dodge? (regardless of enemy setup - like mage only) I read in a guide that dodge runes are a nice way, but when you go deep into it you will lose a huge survival-trait when some1 counters you (with sword of divinity).
I get the point but don't think this is viable, since SoD only lasts 6 seconds, so merely a few attacks if you micro well. And it is also only for this one hero, if every melee/range goes for it you delayed their built and altered / expensived it.
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#13
OFFLINE   eyepoker

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Jax

* Leapstrike Ability Power ratio reduced to .8 from 1
* Counterstrike Ability Power ratio reduced to .6 from .8
* Relentless strikes Ability Power ratio reduced to .7 from 1

AP Jax still on top or AD/AS now?
Killstealing?! no way! Im just making sure they wont get away

people rage over such little things

:P

#14
OFFLINE   Gorgrash

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Right now, due to the patch i am confused too....but I will give some insights as soon i have tried out some more :D
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#15
OFFLINE   Raro

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Thanks guys...
And I guess that with the New Patch AD will be much better although I've been looking at comments and checking it out and AP seemed much more effective if you could get the right build.

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